ALICE BRENNAN: Hey hey ... Alice Brennan here on Background Briefing ... where we put Australia's best investigations in your pod feed every week. We are unstoppable, producing the show from our bedroom studios. I hope the shutdown is treating you well.
If you like what you hear, please don't forget to rate and review us wherever you get your podcast. It makes a big difference and helps get the message out about who we are and what we do. Also, if you do have feedback, we have a Twitter handle, @BackgroundBrief, or you can also write us an email: backgroundbriefing@abc.net.au Before we start the show this week I do want to warn you that we will be touching upon some sensitive themes including suicide.
GRACE RULLIS: I have no idea how to get in
Deb: I thought it was around the side.
GRACE RULLIS: This is it, guys. That's right in the Hub, isn't it?
ALICE BRENNAN: Grace Rullis and her coworkers have just arrived at a Sydney four-star hotel.
TRUDY: I have a twin room and a queen to show you
GRACE RULLIS: Okay. Excited to have a look!
TRUDY: i'll let you jump in
GRACE RULLIS: Today is a big day.
Grace is booking out an entire floor of this hotel for her group... something she's never done before.
Grace wants to be sure this is the right place so she's getting a tour...
TRUDY: So this is a standard room. they all have a desk. They all have blackout blinds and sheer blinds, smart tvs. They have new beds.
GRACE RULLIS: Yeah.
TRUDY: There's a mini bar fridge.
ALICE BRENNAN: Grace is tall, her neatly coiffed blonde hair contrasts against her classic black outfit. Make-up: immaculate. Her mannerisms: confident. She's ironic. Witty, and direct.
Inside, the room is nice enough. But Grace glides straight to the big window.
GRACE RULLIS: What will be really pretty is... The lights, the action, forget all the problems you're downtown. I'm just being silly. We have to get them Netflix don't we? Yep.
ALICE BRENNAN: TV, linen, views -- they're important features of any hotel stay -- but Grace wants to make sure her guests are looked after as well as can be.
GRACE RULLIS:what do you think?
DEB: I like it, I think it's good.
ALICE BRENNAN: And that's because Grace is a social worker and her guests are people experiencing homelessness.
Hagar Cohen -- you tagged along with Grace and her team for this hotel visit --
HAGAR: Yeah, I did Alice - because Grace is actually the manager of a Sydney-based crisis accommodation centre. It's called the Haymarket Foundation.
And last month, the NSW Government awarded the homeless sector - including Grace's foundation special funding -- to book people experiencing homelessness into hotels for a month's stay, potentially even mor.
ALICE BRENNAN: It's so they can isolate during the pandemic, right?
HAGAR COHEN: Yeah, and let me tell you - Grace, Deborah and the gang weren't going to settle for anything less than the best.
ALICE BRENNAN: How many people do experience homelessness in Australia?
HAGAR COHEN: According to the latest census, there were more than 116,000 people experiencing homelessness around Australia. Over 37,000 of them in NSW alone.
ALICE BRENNAN: But being homeless isn't just about not having a home.
HAGAR COHEN: Right, some of the residents from Grace's group have intellectual disabilities, acquired brain injuries, complex mental health disorders, physical disabilities, drug and alcohol dependency, HIV....
GRACE RULLIS: So hopefully that your concierge and staff would be understanding of complex trauma and dignity and respect.
HAGAR COHEN: So Grace wants to make sure the staff here understand ...
GRACE RULLIS: with homeless populations due to their vulnerability, a lot of clients do smoke and that's something they enjoy. And we don't take their choices away from them. Would they have to leave the premises to smoke?
GENERAL MANAGER: Yes, so we have a designated smoking area just out the front of the hotel. It's still within the grounds of the hotel. But it would have to be outside.
HAGAR COHEN: Grace turns and looks around, nodding in approval. It appears it's a done deal
GRACE RULLIS: Great. So girls, you know, we would be on level 7.
HAGAR COHEN: But for Grace and her team, this deal is just the beginning of a whole new set of thorny questions.
You see Grace has 23 clients, and she's booked just 15 rooms.
Now she and her team have to decide who will stay at the shelter, and who will go to the hotel. They'll be moving in next week.
GENERAL MANAGER: Yeah. nice to meet you.
DEB JURD: Thank you.
HAGAR COHEN: As we step out onto the street and start the walk back to the shelter ...Grace and Deb talk candidly about how this might actually work.
They're excited but I can tell they're nervous about what comes next.
GRACE RULLIS: So we really need to test it. And I'm looking at a staged process next week. So not putting 15 people in together.
HAGAR COHEN: It's no secret that hotels and homeless shelters... are run VERY differently.
Grace and her bunch at the Haymarket Foundation are deeply committed to social justice -- they're social workers. Whereas generally hotel staff are trained in customer service, and may not have gotten to know a person experiencing homelessness before.
GRACE RULLIS: I needed to make sure that our residents would be respected like anybody else. So if that wasn't going to occur, I would look at a renegotiation with another hotel. So I was actually, I guess, testing them.
HAGAR COHEN: This is just one of many reasons why Grace feels like this hotel move is such a big deal ... maybe even the biggest in her 11 years at the shelter. She's full of anxiety, fear of the unknown. It's so different to anything she's ever attempted. But that's what also makes it so exciting...there's a hope for a better society.
Right now, the move is just for 30 days. But Grace hopes this new Covid deal will lead to an overhaul of the sector. One where permanent housing is given priority.
GRACE RULLIS: This is the nicest thing that'S come from this whole pandemic, is that equalisation of everyone deserves the same.
HAGAR COHEN: So for Grace, this isn't just about the next 30 days... She wants a revolution.
GRACE RULLIS: people are not only rising to the occasion, they're looking at the way we work. And can there be permanent changes to actually end homelessness?
HAGAR COHEN: It's early morning and I'm driving down to the end of a leafy cul de sac in the heart of inner suburban Sydney
I'm at the Haymarket centre to meet up with one of Grace's most experienced staffers - senior case manager Deborah Jurd.
Deborah is 60. Friendly... and has a great rapport with clients.
Like her boss Grace, Deborah is also direct.
Deborah's armed with a bottle of sanitiser spray in one hand, and disinfectant in the other.
It's how every day begins for her at the moment ... with cleaning. A lot of cleaning
DEBORAH JURD: We are going to the front gate, keep it clean cause that's where the clients will come in and out throughout the day. Obvs we try to keep them on site. But you know they want to go out and come back in. we try and clean the gate every time they come back in
HAGAR COHEN: As you walk in through the big metal gate... The dorms are to the left, facing the main road. There are 3 big sections, and the beds are between 1-2 metres apart.
It's lucky Deborah and her colleagues were satisfied with the hotel visit ...Because this setup as it is now... wouldn't meet social distancing requirements.
DEB JURD: So at the moment we have 23 clients currently accommodated here because a couple of weeks ago we decided that we wouldn't be taking any new referrals in. so some of our clients left and we haven't actually filled the other five beds.
HAGAR COHEN: Deborah and fellow social worker Dinsel Davies are the main people on the ground here.
DINSEL DAVIES: social distancing guys!
HAGAR COHEN: They have the most interaction with the clients day to day, and have been working hard getting everyone up to speed on the pandemic.
DEB JURD: hey mate!
KARL: hi
DEB JURD: How are you feeling today?
KARL: Good Thank you
HAGAR COHEN: This is Karl - he's tall, neatly dressed, and one of the more talkative clients here ... To an outsider, his decaying teeth would be the only hint to a rough life.
DEB JURD: Did you go to the dentist yesterday?
KARL: Friday, the appointment on Friday!
DEB JURD: Who said that?
HAGAR COHEN: Karl nods as Deborah runs through the latest rules about washing hands and social distancing. But when it comes to how he's coping, the conversation takes a turn
DEB JURD: And how are you dealing with the covid 19, the Coronavirus?
KARL: Depressing
DEB JURD: You feel depressed about it?
KARL: Scary
DEB JURD: Ok, what are you scared about?
KARL: Dying
DEB JURD: You scared about dying? Ok.
KARL: I never was scared of dying before. I used to be suicidal before, i try to kill myself all the time
DEB JURD: What makes you scared of dying though, is it because you're watching the news?
KARL: Yes i watch the news all the time
DEB JURD: So you don't have any symptoms, you don't have a sore throat or any kind of cough?
KARL: No
DEB JURD: So you're feeling quite healthy?
KARL: Yes
DEB JURD: Ok, well then you don't need to worry about dying because you're feeling quite healthy
KARL: Yeah
HAGAR COHEN: Before Deborah spoke with Karl, he was actually on her and Grace's list of residents who'd be capable of living independently. Which means they were going to offer him a spot at the luxury hotel. But now Deborah isn't so sure.
GRACE RULLIS: So we've got a bit of work to do today. This is the most important thing we're doing and have done. Changing the scope in the way we work. Hasn't occurred before.
HAGAR COHEN: Grace, Deborah and fellow senior social worker, Dinsel sit around the spacious meeting table.
GRACE RULLIS: I see it as a major opportunity, but we have to.... There are ...uhm... issues that could occur. So I think I want to have us all involved. And for me to oversee it.
HAGAR COHEN: The team is here to discuss who will stay ... and who will go to the hotel.
GRACE RULLIS: Can we go through the list ...so out of ... we're keeping eight people. In our service because we have eight rooms and I have tallied currently 14 clients moving into temporary accommodation
HAGAR COHEN: These 14 clients are selected based on their ability to live independently - alone in a hotel room. Yes, they'll still have contact with the case workers - once a day at least - but it's different to what they have right now at the shelter - which is 24/7 support.
Those who will stay are the more vulnerable ones... they'd find it hard without intensive support.
Deborah is keen to tell Grace about the conversation she just had with Karl.
DEB JURD: When I asked him, he said, I don't want to die. I feel quite depressed about it. So that's sort of a bit of an alert to me in terms of we were thinking about putting him into t.a. And now that I've had that conversation with him this morning, I wasn't aware that he ...uhm...was so invested in in what was going on and quite concerned about it. So. He might prefer to prefer to stay here.
GRACE RULLIS: It's interesting with Karl as well, because his connection is so strong with us, isn't it? Dinsel. My love. Can you just write a list of the definite stayers and just so I can give that number to Peter and we can negotiate the hotel
HAGAR COHEN: As the team goes through the list of clients...I can see the pressure on their faces. Yes this is a massive opportunity, but there is also so much to work out in less than a week.
GRACE RULLIS: And as I'm going through this list and and thinking about things that comes to me like, you know, people could potentially go stir crazy in a small room, even though it's a fancy hotel room. So that doesn't work for everyone. People don't get it.
HAGAR COHEN: It takes a few days... but Grace, Deborah and the team have made a decision.
It'll be best for Karl to stay at the shelter.
But there are many more clients to assess.
DEB JURD: you come down here and see me please mister! Come on. Go to the bathroom and then you come down and see me, okay?
HAGAR COHEN: Simon's been a rough sleeper for years. ... he's got intellectual disabilities, and when his mum - who looked after him - died... he faced homelessness.
Deborah's certain that Simon can't move to the hotel - he's happy at the shelter because they respect him and his need for a routine. But now with Covid19, everything has shifted and that's causing him stress. He doesn't understand social isolation - last night he got upset when staff asked him to keep his distance while he was taking his meds.
DEB JURD: We have to make sure that that people keep their distance
SIMON: Oh
DEB JURD: yeah? So if you want medication we're not going to withhold your medication, but we have a different procedure. Okay? And that procedure is, the staff will leave you outside the door, they'll put it on the sink, and then they'll come out here after they let you in so that we're keeping the 1.5 metres distance
SIMON: Oh
DEB JURD: so tonight what do you do?
SIMON: Stay there
DEB JURD: Until what? And then what? When do you come inside the office?
SIMON: You're not meant to
DEB JURD: You are allowed to, but only when staff say you're allowed
SIMON: Oh
DEB JURD: So its not that they don't want to give it to you. Alright?
SIMON: Yes
DEB JURD: Alright. You go sit down in the sunshine and relax
HAGAR COHEN: After Simon heads off, I ask Deborah what she thought of this conversation.
DEB JURD: With people like him, who have some kind of cognitive deficit they get used to a certain thing that they've been doing for months and months and then if someone changes that... they don't quite understand that straight away. So it's about just reinforcing that on a daily basis and then he'll get it.
HAGAR COHEN: Simon is one of eight residents who Deborah and the team decided will stay at the shelter. But for another resident, Matthew, it's a different outcome.
Matthew's been a rough sleeper for 22 years.
He got to the shelter last month, and has now been told he'll be going to the hotel next Tuesday.
KARL: 2 numbers or 1?
MATTHEW: I only gave you one. This is the one i've got to call you on
Matthew's standing in the courtyard, opposite Karl
He and Matthew have their phones out - they're swapping numbers to make sure they can stay in touch.
MATTHEW: We help each other
HAGAR COHEN: Matthew looks a bit apprehensive about the whole idea...
MATTHEW: I was more comfortable here. I was able to do things and everything else, coz I have to go out and come back. At the hotel you gotta go downstairs and probably no one's out there. You smoke by yourself.
HAGAR COHEN: so some benefits some disadvantages?
MATTHEW: Yeah probably a couple of days i get used to it. But I've been in motels before because i've been on the streets for 22 years.
HAGAR COHEN: How was that?
MATTHEW: It was hard. I was actually on a corner near Woolworths where Civic Banking used to be CitiBank
HAGAR COHEN: So from a street corner to a 4 star hotel hey?
MATTHEW: Yeah. Big change Yeah
HAGAR COHEN: Matthew talking about his past got me thinking about the people who have no shelter at all ... People on the streets where there's not even a choice between this bed and that.
Who is looking out for them? And how are they expected to keep safe?
I am at Belmore Park, which is in Sydney, very close to the city. It's a park that's usually quite busy with lots of international students. The local tai chi group usually sits here and does their exercise ..uhn... and just bypassers going in and out of Central Station. Uhm...Today, it's pretty empty. A few of the benches here are occupied by homeless people, which is not unusual. I have seen here, I mean, it's a bit of a centre for homeless people to to stay. And ...uhm...I'm just trying to count them there's about three homeless people occupying three different benches. One of them is just doing a wee at the corner. uhm...And I'm waiting for the Department of Housing staff.
DANIEL CRAY: too much pressure! Yeah. So what we do is we're just gonna go around the park at the moment. Uh, there's a few rough sleepers here. So we'll just go in and wake them up and see if we can help them get any accommodation and stuff.
HAGAR COHEN: Daniel Cray's a senior officer from the Department and he's leading the city patrol today.
DANIEL CRAY: And ..uhm.. we might as well use you to brief them on the on the health aspect of it before we continue the engagement as well, just due to the Covid 19 virus.
HAGAR COHEN: Daniel's tall with a plume of ginger hair. He's friendly, warm and has a real charm about him, without being imposing. I can see how he can probably get through to anyone.
DANIEL CRAY: So we'll see this gentleman here first, there's a guy just on the bench here.
HAGAR COHEN: Daniel's background is working with prisoners, He joined the department 18 months ago to work with rough sleepers. His job has always been to engage with people on the streets to see if they want help with accomodation.. Only now, he has an offer for them he'd never imagined he'd be able to give - a whole month in a flashy hotel.
DANIEL CRAY: We could give you accommodation until you got paid next. Is that a bit better for ya?
GUY: yeah,yeah
DANIEL CRAY: Just so you're not rushed tomorrow?
GUY: good, I can kick back and watch TV and stuff.
HAGAR COHEN: This guy will now be staying at a boutique four star hotel with views of the city, hyde park and Sydney Harbour.
DANIEL CRAY: it's a provider called Hyde Park Inn, So it's one of our new ones. So I'll write it all down for him.
HAGAR COHEN: Inner city Sydney has more rough sleepers living here than anywhere else in Australia.
On the night of the latest census, figures show that there were 8200 people sleeping rough across the country. About a third of them in NSW ... and the vast majority in Sydney.
Since coronavirus hit, Department of Justice and Communities officers have upped their patrols at hotspots across Sydney to see if any rough sleepers want to stay in hotel rooms. 741 have already agreed.
Daniel's colleague Sharon starts talking to another man nearby -- He hasn't even heard of the coronavirus
SHARON GUDU: no! you haven't heard about the virus? no!. So you know, there's a virus impacting the whole world, including Australia. So we have to like make sure we keep a safe distance so we don't... that no one spreads to each other. Yeah, yeah. And washing your hands a lot and things like that.
HAGAR COHEN: Then a guy runs across the park and approaches Daniel. He says his name is Rodney. He's slouching with a towel over his back, and he's fidgeting I try looking closely at his face -- catch his gaze ... but his eyes are darting. He says his mate told him someone at the park is offering temporary accommodation...
DANIEL CRAY: You are currently rough sleeping at the moment?
RODNEY: Yeah. Just surfing everywhere. Just wherever.
DANIEL CRAY: All right.
DANIEL CRAY: You've been to housing or any before.
RODNEY: I mean, he has never been a housing company once before. Although quite a while ago I was given that would come around as it would have been getting locked up.
DANIEL CRAY: OK. OK, so where have you been sleeping recently?
RODNEY: All over. Waterloo, redfern.
DANIEL CRAY: Oh, I've read couch-surfing.
RODNEY: It was a eight months. Nine months?
DANIEL CRAY: So, Rodney, I can give you some accommodation. It will be sort of around the city way.
RODNEY: One night?
DANIEL CRAY: no we can give you up to 30 days. So straight away.
RODNEY: Yeah. All right. Yeah. God bless you and God bless you. I thank you very much, aye
DANIEL CRAY: So we got you somewhere that's called the Hyde Park Plaza
HAGAR COHEN: But not everyone is jumping at the opportunity like Rodney.
Sharon's right. There are a lot of us.
There's me, Sharon Gudu, and Jacob Connor - they're Daniel's colleagues.... and two other mental health workers from a nearby charity.
We're off to another park, this time in Sydney's inner west.
The man we are about to meet is an immigrant from India, and has been sleeping in this spot in an Ashfield park for about 3 years. Jacob the housing officer knows him.
JACOB CONNOR: he's been a rough sleeper for years now. It's constantly a process of keeping that engagement and trying to offer him support of exactly what we are doing today.
HAGAR COHEN: It's a leafy suburban park, surrounded with red brick apartment buildings and it backs onto the train line... the noise is constant.
JACOB CONNOR: good morning. How are you?
RAVI: Very nice!
JACOB CONNON: I'm Jacob
HAGAR COHEN: This man, who we'll call Ravi looks happy, he's friendly and polite. His hair is freshly combed to one side, clothes clean and tidy.
RAVI: Things are good ... coronavirus!
JACOB CONNOR: Yeah
HAGAR COHEN: Ravi's spot is made up of two benches - one stacked with sleeping bags and blankets, and another has a cheap wine cask and what looks like an open vitamin jar sitting on it.
SHARON GUDU: We would really like you to think about accepting assistance
HAGAR COHEN: He wants to know what happens after the 30 days is up.
RAVI: it's always very hard for me. 30 days of accomodation isn't going to help me in terms of coming back and sleeping in the rain...
SHARON GUDU: It totally makes sense you're saying 30 days and then what after that? The intention is not to send people back to the streets after 30 days, it's to work out the next steps around a long term solution. So we can extend the 30 days... but we'd really, really like to strongly encourage you to think about to getting safely into some accommodation now because of the virus
RAVI: ma'am i seriously would like to thank you for this. But you have a concern for somebody...
HAGAR COHEN: As one train comes after another, Ravi retells his life story. Or at least a life story. About being in the army, and seeing the world. About his family, and his aspirations to be the President of India.
The staff listen patiently.. Jacob thinks Ravi might feel he's different to other rough sleepers... so he reiterates the accommodation on offer is high standard.
JACOB CONNOR: can I just say like we've got an extra 300 rooms that have become available. And they are 4 and 5 star hotels, so You know it's going to be a lot more comfortable than maybe some other accommodation you may have stayed in. Is that something that may interest you?
RAVI: brother, if you really want to help, this is the 5 star hotel. There's no other place
HAGAR COHEN: The housing officials leave disappointed. They were really hoping to get Ravi into a hotel this time around.
JACOB CONNOR: that's how he is every time, and it's just like...
SHARON GUDU: he just really feels he's in a good place
JACOB CONNOR: right and that's why it's to hard to convince him...
HAGAR COHEN: how are you feeling about that?
JACOB CONNOR: I'd still like to see him taking our offer. We'll be engaging with him again shortly.
HAGAR COHEN: But they say, they'll come back for him
Ravi's uncertainty over the 30 day limit is telling - yes, the offer to stay in a 4 or 5 star hotel free of charge is extraordinary - but what happens after that? Will they be moved back to a park bench? Or into public housing?
The statistics aren't promising. Particularly when you look at social housing in NSW - around 50,000 people are already facing a 5-10 year long wait.
Is Ravi expected to join this seemingly impossible waitlist?
HAGAR COHEN: Hello
GARETH WARD: Hagar
HAGAR COHEN: How are you?
GARETH WARD: Very well.
HAGAR COHEN: Good to meet you.
GARETH WARD: Nice to meet you as well too. Oh, sorry, sorry.
HAGAR COHEN: I've come to NSW Parliament to meet The Minister for Families Communities and disability services, Gareth Ward. He's apologetic because he seems to have forgotten about Covid for a second... because he reached out to shake my hand.
HAGAR COHEN: I feel strange not shaking people's hands.
GARETH WARD: No, no, I know.
HAGAR COHEN: His advocacy has helped secure a 34 million dollar investment in the homeless sector. Part of it will be used to provide 30 days hotel accommodation for people facing homelessness during COVID19.
Three different contacts have told me Minister Ward has had a hard time convincing his party colleagues of the need for this kind of investment
Though Minister Ward denies being a lone voice on it.
GARETH WARD: Not at all. I mean, the fact that the premier made this a priority for her shows that this premier is totally committed to care and compassion and social issues that are important.
HAGAR COHEN: The Minister has quite the challenge on his hands. The latest census figures paint a grim picture of soaring rates of homelessess across NSW.
Figures released late last year show that crisis services have had to turn away more than half of the people who have asked for help getting a roof over their head.
And most people who did receive some form of temporary accommodation - a bed in a crisis shelter, boarding house, hostel or motel - did not end up with a permanent home. That means - even with initial help, most people aren't escaping homelesness.
So the 34 million dollar question is...
HAGAR COHEN: what happens at the end of the 30 days? So people are afforded 30 days in hotel accommodation? What happens at the end of that?
GARETH WARD: Well, hopefully we've worked with people successfully to be able to find them permanent accommodation.
HAGAR COHEN: Is there stock available?
GARETH WARD: So we have a program, well two programs, actually, the Social Affordable Housing Fund, where around 60 percent of the way through the build and or delivery of stock there as part of the $34 million announcement, I also was able to extend products like rent choice, rent choice youth, start safely and their private rental subsidies.
HAGAR COHEN: But right now, at the end of that 30 day period, do you have enough stock available for everybody to be able to be transferred into permanent housing?
GARETH WARD: Well that's why we need more social, more affordable housing. And we've acknowledged that and that's why we're building. But when you talk about the immediacy of the response, there are other products that are available to get people housing.
HAGAR COHEN: Is that a commitment from you that everyone who wants permanent housing will get it at the end of this 30 day period?
GARETH WARD: I'd like to be able to give a guarantee for every person. Obviously, this is an enormous challenge. Obviously, it's an enormous challenge.
HAGAR COHEN: The stats suggest Minister Ward's best intentions may not be enough ... But undoubtedly this latest cash injection is helping people into housing .
If you walk around Sydney city right now ... particularly in key homeless hotspots - parks, train stations - they're almost empty.
HAGAR COHEN: Has it taken a pandemic to solve homelessness in New South Wales?
GARETH WARD: What I would say is that COVID has certainly brought a new impetus about what we were doing. But what we've done is, is scale up what we are already doing.
HAGAR COHEN: I'm back at the shelter - it's early morning on the first day of the big move
DINSEL DAVIES: we'll pack this because that's broken. What about this handbag?
KERRIANN: I want this handbag over me shoulder
HAGAR COHEN: Deborah, Grace and the team are all out the front trying to fit 10 residents' belongings into Deborah's hatchback.
GRACE RULLIS: you're going to do 2 car rides right?
DEB JURD: Not if we can fit it all in
GRACE RULLIS: Alright good luck Deborah.
DEB JURD: Where there's a will there's a way.
HAGAR COHEN: And there are more residents waiting, belongings in hand. Makeshift plastic bags, doonas over shoulders, colourful suitcases on wheels
KERRIANNE: Yes. My life in a boot.
HAGAR COHEN: you're gonna fit it all in?
KERRIANN: Hi Grace! How are you darling?
GRACE: you know we're going to be visiting you all the time.
HAGAR COHEN: I spot Matthew, who's moving out to the hotel this morning - he's got his hands full with his own white sheets and warm blankets.
DEB JURD: Sheets? They change sheets at the hotel. They're hotel sheets... MATTHEW: Yeah, but they're my sheets. I was actually saying, if they want to do the bed, I can do me own bed, and do me own things myself.
HAGAR COHEN: So you were trying to be considerate?
MATTHEW: Yeah. even on the streets, if you come to a place and whoever owns the building is happy if you keep your area tidy. Since I was on the streets I'm always keeping everything tidy, so I didn't have any complaints, so I was able to stay there a lot longer.
GRACE RULLIS: well we're ready to go. You're ready to go?
HAGAR COHEN: About 10 residents file back toward a big roller door near the side of the road - some with roller bags dragging behind them on the bumpy footpath.
I can tell they're nervous, excited, but they're ready to get going
KERRIANN: I feel like we're in school excursion!
HAGAR COHEN: I can't help but wonder - what if Grace's mini revolution actually happens? What if everybody here gets a permanent home at the end of all this? They may never come back.
KERRIANN: That's real luxury now. Bath.
GRACE RULLIS: I love a bath. And you know the shampoo they give you, you can put that into the bath and then make it a bubble bath
HAGAR COHEN: When we get to the hotel, we're met by a black-suited hotel staffer named 'GG'
GG: Hello everyone! Very exciting. Were very very pleased to have you all. We will quickly get you the keys. There's a small form which we would like to fill, and then after that you're off to go and get yourself settled and most importantly welcome and enjoy!
GRACE RULLIS: thanks GG! Perfect guys! Let's get you sorted!
HAGAR COHEN: Matthew and another resident from the shelter, huddle in a corner of the foyer near a big tv screen... they're going through the letter from the hotel outlining their new house rules.
MATTHEW: they do room service once a week, delivery fresh towels and Curfew by 10pm-4pm. Construction noise. Doors locked at 10pm but you have keys to access building at all times. Only registered guests of the hotel permitted in the hotel between 10pm and 6am, no guests are permitted overnight or more than 2 persons may be in the room at any time at the room.
HAGAR COHEN: GG asks us to head over to the lifts and up to the rooms. Everybody is chatting happily to each other. But I catch Matthew - he's now standing on his own.
HAGAR COHEN: how are you feeling?
MATTHEW: Hmm... so so.
HAGAR COHEN: A bit anxious?
MATTHEW: Yeah. It's a shock as i walked in. it's different.
HAGAR COHEN: We're told two by two in the lift again, I hop in with Matthew. He avoids eye contact with me and fidgets nervously with his room's swipe key.
MATTHEW: Where's the numbers gone...
CLERK: Which one now
MATTHEW: 718....
CLERK: Just around the corner
MATTHEW: this IS nice! Nice bathrooms. Toilet shower, Conditioner, shampoo, and shower...shower gel for the bath! Tissues. Even got a cup in here.
HAGAR COHEN: How are you feeling right now?
MATTHEW: shocked. Actually the room.... Usually, like housing might put you in a Temporary Accommodation, and it's probably instead of a 4 star hotel, it's like a 1 star, where it's just.. looks like a dump... and when you walk in there's hardly anything. This is actually better than the ones I've been in. So yeah, it's...nice standards.
HAGAR COHEN: You're happy to spend time here?
MATTHEW: i do want to be alone, but also know I don't want to be alone, so... I should turn everything on.
HAGAR COHEN: The group takes up the whole of level seven ... I walk out into the hall and a few people are buzzing around. Everybody is settling in.
GRACE RULLIS: how are you going sweetheart?
DEB JURD: just going through the rooms.
HAGAR COHEN: I run into Grace who's standing back ... taking it all in ...what's unfolding around her is the beginning of her dream for the group ... for people who experience homelessness ... finally becoming a reality.
HAGAR COHEN: Can I ask you a personal question?
GRACE RULLIS: Sure.
HAGAR COHEN: How are you?
GRACE RULLIS: I'm brilliant. I'm excited. I feel really inspired. I'm a social worker. And I come from a social justice perspective of human rights. I am absolutely seeing this as a space that we can look at actually long, sustainable, systematic change. And personally, I've never been more actually excited in a long time. The people we work with they're beautifully resilient. But I love when they get excited and we can give them hope again.
HAGAR COHEN: Thank you Grace
GRACE RULLIS: Pleasure
Background Briefing's Sound Producers are Leila Shunnar and Ingrid Wagner.
Sound engineering by Isabella Tropiano
Fact-checking by Ben Sveen
Supervising Producers are Gina McKeon, Ben Sveen and Alex Mann.
Our Executive Producer is Alice Brennan.
And I'm Hagar Cohen
You can hear us on the ABC Listen app, or..subscribe to Background Briefing wherever you get your podcasts.
And ... if you like what you're hearing ... please give us a rating and a review ... it really helps other people find out about the show.
Thanks for listening!
People experiencing homelessness are being moved from the street and shelters into four-star hotels.
The radical plan is meant to protect them from the pandemic and it's temporary.
But as Hagar Cohen discovers, there are questions about what happens once the virus crisis is over.